Session Start: Sun Oct 04 00:00:00 2015 Session Ident: #glitchpc [00:00] * Now talking in #glitchpc
[00:00] * Topic is 'Welcome to #glitchpc chat. Profanity, trolls, and impersonation are not welcome here. Street1 has become a Silent Keyboard. http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/savannah/obituary.aspx?page=lifestory&pid=139870551'
[00:00] * Set by jacky on Tue Mar 02 18:03:23
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[00:24] * loonytoon (sid7968@mib-8AE0B64A.highgate.irccloud.com) has left #glitchpc

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Session Start: Sun Oct 04 04:00:18 2015 Session Ident: #glitchpc [04:00] * Now talking in #glitchpc
[04:00] * Topic is 'Welcome to #glitchpc chat. Profanity, trolls, and impersonation are not welcome here. Street1 has become a Silent Keyboard. http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/savannah/obituary.aspx?page=lifestory&pid=139870551'
[04:00] * Set by jacky on Tue Mar 02 18:03:23
[04:00] * ChanServ sets mode: +a
[04:00] * ChanServ sets mode: +o ChanbotVIII
[05:43] * Zuwer (Mibbit@mib-B8942752.jetstream.xtra.co.nz) has joined #glitchpc
[17:11]<Veltas> BC_Programming: Typing is no substitute for thinking.
[17:13]<@BC_Programming> That is my profile text yes... ?
[17:16]<Veltas> implying you didn't really think through what you said before replying to my post
[17:17]<@BC_Programming> No, I did.
[17:20]<Veltas> Well you're accusing me of shifting my responsibilities, or that MS did nothing wrong.
[17:20]<Veltas> I don't think I'm out of line for saying that feature is dumb
[17:21]<Veltas> And I certainly am not trying to suggest that you can trust a folder generated sketchily in a recovery marked "Windows.old" is 100% reliable super secure storage
[17:22]<Veltas> But where exactly is the line drawn for what is and isn't acceptable to just delete without warning, especially for folders which almost certainly contain user files?
[17:32]<Quantos> Can I have a link to the post guys?
[17:33] * Quantos is nosy today
[17:33]<Veltas> http://www.computerhope.com/forum/index.php/topic,152546.0.html
[17:38]<Quantos> Ah
[17:38]<Quantos> Personally I think it's windows fault
[17:38]<Quantos> But I blame them for earthquakes too...
[17:39]<Quantos> And eclipses, it's those damned shaman they have on staff
[17:48]<Veltas> Yeah personally I think both the user (me) and Windows are at fault
[17:48]<Veltas> Windows is not at any serious fault here, but it seems like poor form
[17:49]<@BC_Programming> I think the problem is the stupid articles telling people about the folder, since it's normally a hidden system folder not intended for users to access at all
[17:49]<Veltas> I promise I'm not just being irrational and crying and complaining about that nasty Mr Windows that deleted my precious cat pictures. Time has moved on and nothing really that important was lost, I didn't bother doing a backup for those files because they were never that important
[17:50]<Veltas> BC_Programming: Except it isn't, I made a reply to your further reply where I quote the dialog that makes this folder
[17:51]<@BC_Programming> I see
[17:52]<@BC_Programming> well that's good
[17:52]<@BC_Programming> I get sick of defending Windows 10 pretty quick. Piece of shit
[17:52]<Veltas> Yeah I don't really know much about Windows 10 at all. I was only complaining about 8. I have no idea if the Timer is still in 10.
[17:53]<@BC_Programming> most of what I can find seems to indicate it's new in Win10
[17:54]<@BC_Programming> it appears in the disk cleanup stuff though
[17:54]<Veltas> I can say that when I was searching for info on this, there were a lot of threads along the line of "Help! I did a disk cleanup and Windows.old got deleted!"
[17:54]<@BC_Programming> Nothing could possibly stack up against the absolute piece of trash that Cortana is though
[17:55]<Veltas> And the answer to those threads is "yes, Windows.old is an option in the disk cleanup. You should have read through the options."
[17:55]<@BC_Programming> not sure if it is checked by default, if it is that would be dumb
[17:56]<@BC_Programming> hmm though I wonder if other tools might delete it without checking too, like ccleaner
[17:56]<@BC_Programming> "lolz u won't need dis"
[17:56]<Veltas> It is checked by default. However the disk cleanup thing is less dumb because at least it gives you an opportunity to review this.
[17:56]<Veltas> No idea bout ccleaner, don't use it
[17:57]<@BC_Programming> I tried Cortana though, that was funny until I realized how much time they wasted on it. "Hey Cortana, Launch Firefox" So it launched Edge and google searched for "Launch Firefox" are you kidding me
[17:57]<@BC_Programming> oh sorry no it "bing searched"
[17:58]<Veltas> Yeah I kind of question the direction MS has been taking their efforts since just after Vista
[17:58]<Veltas> I think they spent ages trying to do good, and then Vista came out and the only significant things people remember are that the interface was annoying and it didn't run on toasters
[18:00]<Veltas> At which point the Windows crew went crawling on their knees to the Marketing department and said "we're so sorry we ever doubted you, you truly are the most important dept. in Microsoft"
[18:01]<@BC_Programming> They seem to be trying to move to Mobile-style stuff
[18:01]<@BC_Programming> I don't really mind using it but holy crap is the development ecosystem a pile of garbage
[18:01]<@BC_Programming> I mean the Modern UI Windows stuff, dunno about Android or iOS
[18:02]<Veltas> My understanding is that their API is good, their tools are good, their docs are good
[18:02]<Veltas> But people aren't using it enough and stackoverflow won't return the results to every problem so therefore it's garbage
[18:03]<@BC_Programming> Win32API stuff is fine, their Modern UI/App framework stuff has very little documentation, and it pretty much requires Visual Studio
[18:04]<@BC_Programming> Or rather, it has documentation, but it's clear as mud
[18:05]<@BC_Programming> My main annoyance is that it is very web service oriented, though I don't think that is unique in the mobile space... it is weird to bring that limitation over to the desktop
[18:08]<Veltas> Yeah the web service stuff
[18:09]<Veltas> I basically think the reason so much dev stuff is focused around the web now is not because the web is particularly helpful in the domain of application development, but because it's all that most app developers are reliably skilled in
[18:09]<Veltas> Because the assumption is now that everyone knows web development or something
[18:09]<Veltas> Which is annoying to me because that's the one thing I don't really know about
[18:09]<Veltas> Maybe I'm biased
[20:21]<+camerongray> Well, web stuff is also super cross platform
[20:22]<@BC_Programming> only on the web though :P
[20:22]<+camerongray> True
[20:22]<@BC_Programming> won't be running Windows App Framework stuff on Linux or Mac OS heh
[20:22]<+camerongray> The majority of applications I build are now web based, doesn't matter what device is being used to connect to it as long as it has an internet connection
[20:22]<+camerongray> Not really useful if you require any sort of OS or hardware access of course
[20:22]<+camerongray> But for a lot of applications it's ideal
[20:23]<+camerongray> If I need something to be cross platform I'd much rather have it web based than some horrible Java thing
[20:24]<+camerongray> Although I agree that Web shouldn't be used for everything, things like Atom take it a bit too far IMO
[20:24]<@BC_Programming> Yeah That makes perfect sense. But the advantages of that come with some limitations, mostly because of being on the web. And being able to basically browse to a URL and get the same experience (or at least something pretty much the same) regardless of platform works alright. The issue I have is that stuff like the Windows Modern UI/etc. stuff brings those limitations to client applications
[20:24]<@BC_Programming> but without any of those other advantages
[20:24]<+camerongray> Ahh yeah
[20:24]<+camerongray> I need to play with Windows development more, haven't touched it in years
[20:25]<+camerongray> It's really annoying, I prefer Linux as an OS but I can't stand developing GUI application for it after doing it on Windows
[20:25]<@BC_Programming> My main annoyance with the new Windows app stuff is there is literally no option to enable using the new UI framework while still being able to use the same class libraries
[20:26]<@BC_Programming> So for example you can't create a project that references the npgsql postgres library, instead you would have to have your "app" connect to some web service that provides equivalent functionality
[20:26]<+camerongray> Ahh, that does sound pretty nasty
[20:27]<@BC_Programming> Makes sense for phones/mobile development because as I understand it that is pretty much the standard approach
[22:00]<Veltas> My limited understanding of the web suggests that it's a really horrific platform
[22:00]<Veltas> Trying to support all the different devices and making sure that it's robust and all that
[22:09]<@BC_Programming> It is, but it is probably a lot better than trying to get a native app to work across different platforms, too
[22:09] * jamer (AndChat298@EAD12253.95DF854A.1790492C.IP) has joined #glitchpc
[22:11]<+camerongray> Yeah, and nowadays browsers are all pretty standards compliant
[22:11]<+camerongray> And there are loads of frontend frameworks that do loads of that work for you
[22:12]<@BC_Programming> unrelated but for some reason I just bought an XBox One
[22:12]<+camerongray> Wow, you have a problem :O
[22:12]<+camerongray> :P*
[22:12]<@BC_Programming> heh
[22:12]<+camerongray> I haven't bought anything ridiculous in ages
[22:12]<jamer> O.o
[22:12]<@BC_Programming> I've been on a retro stint lately
[22:13]<jamer> Was it for the "1080"p graphics
[22:13]<@BC_Programming> No mostly for Forza 6
[22:13]<jamer> ?^
[22:13]<@BC_Programming> Well that's a lie it's probably mostly because I like new shiny things
[22:14]<jamer> Ah, that's the one thing I wish there was a pc port for
[22:14]<@BC_Programming> yeah that and arguably Rare replay, though that will come later since I think I have the originals of all the games on there that I like
[22:16]<@BC_Programming> Though at least I don't already have an XBox One, couldn't say the same when I bought a Nintendo DS on four separate occasions
[22:16]<jamer> Lol
[22:17]<@BC_Programming> hmm actually three I suppose, though I guess I have to count my 3ds as well
[22:17]<+camerongray> Meanwhile I'm saving up money :P
[22:17]<@BC_Programming> Money won't do you any good in a zombie apocalypse. An XBox One though? Blunt force trauma
[22:18]<jamer> Cameron I wish I could say the same but its hard saving when I've got none coming in :(
[22:18]<@BC_Programming> yeah that's pretty important for that
[22:19]<@BC_Programming> oh I know, I know! This is to celebrate that raise I got, yeah that's it
[22:20]<jamer> I'll just leave my negativeness to that.. So bc_programming what other games are you going to get?
[22:21]<@BC_Programming> no idea. I'll probably end up getting more, that is what happened with the Wii U. Got it for Mario Kart 8 but got others along the way
[22:21]<+camerongray> BC_Programming: Well yeah, but I want to buy somewhere to live at some point :P
[22:21]<@BC_Programming> pssh
[22:22]<@BC_Programming> owning a house is expensive, you can't complain when something breaks because you have the fix it yourself
[22:22]<+camerongray> True
[22:22]<+camerongray> But renting is more expensive and is essentially flushing money down the toilet every month
[22:23]<+camerongray> And I'd much rather if something broke that I could just fix it instead of battling agencies to send someone to fix it which can take weeks
[22:24]<@BC_Programming> yeah that is true, I guess it depends on who you rent from
[22:24]<@BC_Programming> when I have problems it's practically dealt with the next day
[22:24]<+camerongray> Yeah
[22:24]<jamer> Like that shower door incident
[22:24]<@BC_Programming> lol
[22:24]<+camerongray> My current agent is great and they do fix stuff very quickly
[22:24]<+camerongray> But I'm still losing money every month
[22:25]<@BC_Programming> but regarding it being "throwing money away" to rent, owning a home is pitched as a good investment, and it's true, but when you own a home you're also going to be paying interest, property taxes, homeowner's insurance, flood insurance, mortgage insurance if you had <20% down payment, maintenance/repairs, etc.
[22:26]<+camerongray> Yeah, but it will still go up in value in the end
[22:26]<jamer> Each has its downfalls and advantages
[22:26]<@BC_Programming> Assuming there isn't a housing crash
[22:26]<+camerongray> Yeah, that is the risk
[22:27]<+camerongray> I'd still rather do it and get somewhere I like that I can know I can stay in for as long as I want
[22:27]<jamer> I rent but for me that's the only viable option
[22:27]<@BC_Programming> oh, do you plan to buy outright after saving? That could work well I suppose
[22:27]<+camerongray> Nah, I'd have a mortgage for like a milion years
[22:28]<@BC_Programming> heh
[22:28]<+camerongray> But even that works out quite a bit cheaper than renting
[22:28]<+camerongray> Housing here is expensive
[22:28]<+camerongray> Current 2 bed flat is £695/mo and that would be classed as really cheap
[22:29]<@BC_Programming> I pay $750 myself, 2 bedrooms, but that's canadian so like 2 pounds
[22:29]<+camerongray> Jesus that's cheap :P
[22:29]<jamer> Housing here is cheap but you have to drive everywhere to get anywhere
[22:29]<@BC_Programming> oh wow that's less than 400 pounds
[22:29]<+camerongray> Then to buy a cheapish 1 bed flat in a decent area is around £150,000
[22:30]<@BC_Programming> and I can see the ocean, hmm maybe you should move to Canada
[22:30]<Veltas> I think Forza is developed near to where I am right now
[22:30]<@BC_Programming> heh nice callback :P
[22:30]<Veltas> Also I knew someone who worked at Rare
[22:30]<@BC_Programming> My uncle worked at Nintendo
[22:30]<+camerongray> I work around the corner from where GTA was made :P
[22:30]<Veltas> Nice
[22:31]<@BC_Programming> (^ /s of course)
[22:31]<Veltas> Ah right didn't really take in the 'Nintendo' part anyway
[22:32]<Veltas> They worked on the Gameboy stuff and told me some interesting things about how development went in Assembly and in C
[22:32]<Veltas> Basically C is easier to work with than Assembly, can confirm
[22:32]<jamer> Don't know anyone in the gaming industry
[22:33]<@BC_Programming> me either, unless they're keeping it a secret I suppose
[22:34]<Veltas> There is a mini game industry where I live. I think it's because CodeMasters are based around here.
[22:37]<@BC_Programming> It was between the XB1 and a New 3DS actually, but I already have a 3DS and don't really have a need for the enhancements made in the new model. Also "new 3DS" is a stupid name
[22:38]<jamer> Lol
[22:39]<jamer> Everything in my area is cars farming for food
[22:39]<jamer> Honda makes 40% of their parts almost 10 minutes away
[22:40]<@BC_Programming> "Cars farming for food" gave me the wrong mental image I think
[22:40]<Veltas> ^
[22:41]<+camerongray> You have all those consoles but you still haven't bought a phone yet? :P
[22:42]<@BC_Programming> heh I was going to mention that initially that I've avoiding it
[22:42]<@BC_Programming> I have looked at them a few times
[22:43]<Veltas> Did you ever have one of the older smartphones or a PDA?
[22:44]<@BC_Programming> Never owned a smartphone
[22:44]<Veltas> What about a PDA?
[22:44]<jamer> My phone that I have broke and I ironically fixed it
[22:44]<@BC_Programming> nope No PDA
[22:44]<jamer> Probably a flip phone of sorts
[22:45]<@BC_Programming> Closest thing then and now is probably a calculator
[22:45]<Veltas> Honestly you're better off. I don't see the point.
[22:45]<+camerongray> Well, being contactable
[22:45]<Veltas> Phone doesn't need to be smart to do that
[22:45]<+camerongray> Being able to look things up if I'm out
[22:46]<+camerongray> And it does if contactable includes email
[22:46]<Veltas> I think it's unreasonable to expect someone to answer their emails when they're away from their desk
[22:46]<@BC_Programming> It wouldn't be very useful for me personally I don't think, either. But, of course, it's not as if a XBox One is productive
[22:46]<+camerongray> Have fun then when you have a job that requires that
[22:47]<Veltas> Phones are so bad at writing as well
[22:47]<Veltas> I was kind of hoping to get a job were I spend 99% of my time sitting down
[22:47]<+camerongray> Which I have but I do also need to be able to get emails out of hours.etc
[22:48]<jamer> Veltas my old job I had to answer text messages while I was out and about at customers houses.. Hell I got told off for not answering a call while driving
[22:48]<Veltas> I spend my time at home sitting down as well
[22:48]<@BC_Programming> you guys might want to sit down for this mindblower- I'm sitting down as well
[22:48]<+camerongray> haha
[22:48]<+camerongray> It's also very handy to be able to look stuff up/get directions.etc on the move
[22:48]<Veltas> I think realistically a lot of people could get away without a smartphone
[22:49]<@BC_Programming> Yeah I think it's utility depends on lot on what you do day to day
[22:49]<+camerongray> Well yeah, you could live without one, I probably could, but it makes life a lot easier
[22:49] * jamer (AndChat298@EAD12253.95DF854A.1790492C.IP) Quit (Connection reset by peer)
[22:49]<Veltas> I mean what I basically just said is "no it doesn't make life a lot easier... depending on your life"
[22:49]<@BC_Programming> Jamer had to answer a text message
[22:50]<Veltas> It doesn't make /my/ life a lot easier. But it could do.
[22:50]<Veltas> Incidentally I do have a smartphone, I got my first about a year ago
[22:50]<@BC_Programming> OTOH I suppose one wouldn't know how much an improvement is to be had without actually getting one
[22:50]<Veltas> Before that I had a PDA in 2004 or something
[22:50]<@BC_Programming> ^(I speak of myself of course)
[22:50]<+camerongray> For example every morning I use my phone to check the times of nearby buses so I know what stop to go to, and I then use my phone to pay for the ticket instead of having to carry coins
[22:51]<Veltas> And I was like "wow these things have changed since they became phones and their interface was redone to match what Steve Jobs decided was a better idea"
[22:51]<Veltas> camerongray: The buses in my area are incapable of reporting the correct times
[22:51]<@BC_Programming> Unless my TI Nspire counts. Does it count? I dunno
[22:51] * Guest3520 (AndChat298@EAD12253.95DF854A.1790492C.IP) has joined #glitchpc
[22:51]<Veltas> In fact they're reliably late, to the extent I can usually turn up 20 mins late to a bus
[22:51]<+camerongray> Ahh, ours are really good, all GPS tracked
[22:51]<Veltas> If they were late enough they'd actually be on time
[22:52]<Veltas> God and they complain in Scotland but really they're living the dream
[22:52]<+camerongray> And then even arranging to meet people is often done over things like IRC or Facebook
[22:52]<Veltas> I get people's phonenumbers and call them
[22:52]<@BC_Programming> I like how IRC and facebook are practically the opposite sides of a spectrum heh :P
[22:52]<+camerongray> But that's a pain as a group
[22:53]<Veltas> I've been told by multiple people I'm the only reason they know what their ringtone sounds like
[22:53]<+camerongray> Not to mention it's good for entertainment when sitting on a bus for hours
[22:54]<Veltas> Honestly I always have stuff to think about
[22:54]<Veltas> Hmm that sounds different from how I intend it to sound
[22:54]<@BC_Programming> I think my issue is that I would want to get an unlocked one
[22:55]<Veltas> No that's okay BC_Programming you get to set the pin code yourself ... /s
[22:55]<+camerongray> BC_Programming: Loads of them available, all of mine for the last few years have been unlocked or were bought due to being easy to unlock
[22:55]<@BC_Programming> well yeah I mean unlocked as in no set carrier
[22:55]<Veltas> What's the point of unlocking?
[22:55]<+camerongray> I buy my devices outright and then get a SIM only plan
[22:56]<Veltas> ^
[22:56]<@BC_Programming> unlocked means it has no set carrier isn't part of a contract deal or any of that
[22:56]<Veltas> That's what I did with my phone
[22:56]<+camerongray> Current phone was £289 to buy, SIM plan is £18/mo
[22:56]<@BC_Programming> but those are also more expensive
[22:56]<Guest3520> Dang cell connection
[22:56] * Guest3520 is now known as jamer
[22:56]<@BC_Programming> and then you need to get a sim for uh, cell stuff
[22:56]<Veltas> Ah so my SIM plan is less expensive, but my phone was more expensive
[22:56]<@BC_Programming> But then I wonder what I'd be paying for since 99.9% of the time I'm within range of my router
[22:56]<Veltas> I'm basically stuck with my phone forever because I will never think to change it
[22:57]<Veltas> Which is the LG Nexus 5
[22:57]<+camerongray> Ahh cool
[22:57]<@BC_Programming> that is relatively recent isn't it?
[22:57]<jamer> I'm on ting which is where I pay for what I use
[22:57]<Veltas> Nope
[22:57]<+camerongray> I had a Nexus 4, only replaced it because it is dying on me
[22:57]<Veltas> jamer: I've heard good things about Ting
[22:57]<@BC_Programming> isn't the latest the Nexus 6?
[22:57]<+camerongray> Now have a OnePlus 2
[22:57]<Veltas> The OnePlus is a silly size
[22:57]<+camerongray> I thought it was at first but I'm totally used to it now, everything else feels tiny
[22:57]<Veltas> Honestly I think the Nexus 5 is a little too big
[22:58]<Veltas> Nexus 4 was a good size probably
[22:58]<+camerongray> Was trying to use my mum's iPhone 5, could barely work out how to hold it
[22:58]<@BC_Programming> All the people on the bus look like ants
[22:59]<jamer> My current phone is small but it has no bezels to worry with
[22:59]<Veltas> Bezels are good though
[22:59]<Veltas> That's how you hold it
[22:59]<Veltas> Phones should have bezels and physical buttons
[22:59]<+camerongray> huh? I never touch the bezel
[23:00]<@BC_Programming> lol woah old school
[23:00]<@BC_Programming> probably want a full qwerty too
[23:00]<+camerongray> But yeah, most Motorola and Nexus devices are cheap to buy unlocked
[23:00]<Veltas> camerongray: Well I do so there is a problem
[23:00]<jamer> I have enough of. Side edge to hold it that way
[23:00]<jamer> Of a *
[23:01]<Veltas> I hold my phone like I would a brick I was about to throw at someone
[23:01]<+camerongray> So do I I suppose, but I don't have any part of my hand touching the screen/bezels
[23:02]<Veltas> I like to hold my phone so hard that it changes shape and bends
[23:02]<Veltas> Okay maybe not
[23:03]<jamer> *bendgate* ^veltas
[23:03]<@BC_Programming> "I charged my iphone in the microwave like I saw on youtube and now it doesn't work"
[23:04]<Veltas> If I bend my Nexus 5 I can be like the cool kids with iPhones
[23:05]<jamer> When the iPhone 6 came out I actually seen people who had bent their phone an wanted it fixed since warranty didn't over it
[23:06]<@BC_Programming> isn't it "bendable" because it omits the rigid backplates more common in phones to reduce weight or something?
[23:06]<Veltas> I don't get why phones are still getting larger though
[23:06]<Veltas> I think part the reason it bends so easily is because it was larger as well
[23:07]<@BC_Programming> I think those larger ones are typically called 'phablets'?
[23:07]<@BC_Programming> no idea if that is pejorative though
[23:07]<Veltas> I couldn't fit a piece of A5 paper in my pocket without creasing it, so why would I buy a Nexus 6? etc.
[23:07]<+camerongray> Yeah, anythign bigger than the OP2 would be too big for me
[23:07]<+camerongray> I can just about cope but it is as big as I could go
[23:07]<jamer> It was because of the aluminum frame they used had weaker spots in it that allow it to bend when enough force was put on it
[23:08]<Veltas> Can you use the smartwatches as phone replacements?
[23:08]<Veltas> If so I would consider that actually
[23:08]<@BC_Programming> I think those link to a smartphone which is a bit goofy
[23:08]<Veltas> :S
[23:08]<jamer> It's more of a phone companion
[23:08]<Veltas> That's so dumb
[23:09]<Veltas> Imagine if you needed a desktop nearby to use a smartphone
[23:09]<jamer> Uses Bluetooth or similar to connect and actually call
[23:09]<@BC_Programming> it's like it is intended to remove the first-world inconvenience of having to take out your phone
[23:09]<Veltas> Oh wait actually that's what PDAs were and I bought one of those... hmmm
[23:09]<@BC_Programming> but it is consistent with smartphones, which is to say they make rather awful watches for telling time
[23:10]<@BC_Programming> If you want a watch to tell time you want a normal wristwatch. if you use a smartwatch for that purpose you'll look like you're having a seizure shaking your hand to wake it up
[23:10]<Veltas> If there was a smartwatch that wasn't horrific at doing really basic stuff like phone / email / maybe a little googling
[23:10]<jamer> With the apple watch it would almost be cheaper to get a Rolex
[23:10]<Veltas> I would definitely get that after my Nexus 5 dies
[23:11]<+camerongray> A watch would be too small for any of that though
[23:11]<+camerongray> And you pretty much have to use voice commands which isn't great in certain situations
[23:11]<Veltas> I dunno, I feel like it should be possible
[23:11]<Veltas> Not with voice commands
[23:11]<jamer> Google is working on a gesture based watch
[23:11]<@BC_Programming> Oh yeah? well a few decades ago people would have said a suitcase was too small for the stuff we now have in smartphones :P
[23:11]<+camerongray> How would you possibly type on something so small?
[23:11]<Veltas> I mean think about it: a phone from 2003 was controlled with a pad about as large as a large watchface anyway
[23:12]<Veltas> Why the **** not?
[23:12]<Veltas> camerongray: You need to think outside the box
[23:12]<Veltas> Obviously you would not 'type' on it
[23:12]<+camerongray> Well, sure you can have some sort of innovative keyboard
[23:12]<+camerongray> But it'll surely be a frustrating experience
[23:12]<jamer> Gesture based .. Basically would have a virtual keyboard that you type in airv
[23:13]<@BC_Programming> yeah probably wouldn't type, would certainly limit what you can do with it but outside initial setup (setup accounts and stuff) you would be able to browse and see your E-mail and stuff I guess
[23:13]<+camerongray> Yeah, for viewing stuff they are great
[23:13]<Veltas> camerongray: Only as frustrating as anything else has been on phones. I mean you're used to it but I still find phones really annoying
[23:13]<+camerongray> But the idea is that you would get a message and check it on your watch, if you need to reply you get your phone out
[23:13]<Veltas> Honestly I'd rather cut down on what they can do and just focus on the essentials, if they can fit that in a watch I'd buy it
[23:14]<+camerongray> I just can't think of any way to type quickly on such a small screen
[23:14]<@BC_Programming> I do too... but I recognize the problem is with me moreso than the phone (or tablet, as has been the case for me more often)
[23:14]<jamer> BTW I do own a phablet also that I use as a tablet only
[23:15]<Veltas> I'm not going to lie, part of the reason I'd bother with a slower input technique on a watch is because it would actually be really cool
[23:15]<Veltas> Phones aren't cool, wrist-computers are cool
[23:15]<@BC_Programming> Come to think of it I can never remember how to turn my parents TV on or off
[23:17]<Veltas> Hmm if I strap my phone to my wrist it would be like a wrist computer
[23:17]<Veltas> Can't think of a secure way of doing this
[23:17]<jamer> Lost my remote a few times ... I found the power button
[23:17]<@BC_Programming> the switch is invisible or capacitive or whatever, if I remember correctly. I had the same problem with a PS3. "Did I press it? is it turning on? I better press it again... oops, now it's off again" lol
[23:18]<jamer> https://www.google.com/atap/project-soli/
[23:19]<Veltas> jamer: Now that's cool
[23:19]<Veltas> See, if you put your mind to it, you can accomplish anything
[23:19]<Veltas> That's what the Doc taught me
[23:19]<jamer> That's what I was trying to say with watched sized phones
[23:20]<Veltas> Yeah no I see that now
[23:20]<Veltas> That doesn't actually immediately solve our problem, but it's a step
[23:20]<@BC_Programming> Better than Cortana
[23:20]<Veltas> You know we had technology in the early 2000s that let us use a projected keyboard on a flat surface
[23:22]<+camerongray> Yeah
[23:22]<jamer> It's far from solving but its step ... In class last week our teacher was talking about web 2.0 he was kinda contemplating web 3.0 as being based on thoughts alone (aka brain based computing and such) and I honestly think that would be the last step on the board to fix our smaller device issue
[23:22]<Veltas> Stuff like this http://www.amazon.com/CTX-VK200-Red-Projection-Keyboard/dp/B008D6IUG4
[23:22]<Veltas> I don't know how well it works
[23:23]<Veltas> Also we had it well before iPhones existed IIRC
[23:23]<Veltas> The product page calls it 'revolutionary'
[23:23]<+camerongray> If anyone discusses stuff as being "web 2.0" and "web 3.0" I instantly disregard what they are saying
[23:23]<@BC_Programming> heheh
[23:24]<Veltas> I mean web 2.0 was legitimately a useful term around 2001 or something
[23:24]<Veltas> But people ran away with it
[23:24]<+camerongray> Yeah
[23:24]<@BC_Programming> AJAX was more descriptive IMO
[23:24]<Veltas> It's like cloud was a legitimate term and then basically everyone jumped in on it
[23:24]<+camerongray> "Web 3.0 will be mind control" sounds like the ramblings of someone who read too much sci-fi, not someone who is meant to understand what they are talking about
[23:25]<Veltas> THe thing about buzzwords is they're usually just made out of actual words and you can't copyright / patent / reasonably argue against incorrect usage
[23:25]<@BC_Programming> web 3.0 will be the holodeck. I suggest we try using a deflector array to emit a charged tachyon pulse
[23:26]<Veltas> Well I mean the web was just articles and multimedia, and then web 2.0 is about being able to interact and change what's there... so I don't exactly see what web 3.0 could possibly be.
[23:26]<Veltas> Whenever someone says web 3.0 I feel like they've missed the point of what web 2.0 was about anyway
[23:27]<Veltas> But yeah it's not a very technical term
[23:27]<+camerongray> Oh yeah, they basically don't know what it refererd to and try to use it as though they are referring to generations of technology in general
[23:28]<+camerongray> If I had a lecturer that said that, I'd be very concerned about how much they actually knew
[23:28]<jamer> Maybe its the online gaming scene and someone overshot their mark
[23:29]<Veltas> I mean I think we only recently managed to figure out that HTML 5 isn't really what everyone was saying it was because HTML itself is mostly static in nature
[23:29]<+camerongray> Just because it was in a movie doesn't make it practical in real life
[23:29]<jamer> Digital multimedia teacher .. He thinks the class is an unneeded class and so does half the faculty but the higher ups still have him teach it
[23:29]<+camerongray> Current systems to interact with a computer with your brain do exist, but they require sensors on the head and total concentration
[23:29]<@BC_Programming> I had an animation class, we did 3DS max, it was cool
[23:29]<+camerongray> Sure some of that can be improved but you can't totally make it so I look at my phone, think what I want it to do and it does it
[23:30]<+camerongray> Otherwise my messages would be "Hey, I'll be there right I should cross the road now, oh look a squirrel, oh yeah, in a minute"
[23:30]<@BC_Programming> it only works if you believe
[23:30]<jamer> Basically the class is more of history of the internet and how we can use it
[23:30]<Veltas> What does web 3.0 have to do with digital multimedia? What is it with media courses and this ridiculous scope creep?
[23:31]<+camerongray> This is why I study theory :P
[23:31]<+camerongray> It can be annoying at times, but at least nothing is made up or imagined
[23:32]<Veltas> Yeah I did a computer graphics course once, and basically the first week didn't require a computer or really any maths, it was just about perception and really "out there" stuff
[23:32]<jamer> He does the website design classes and the art classes .. I had to take it because of my major being network security
[23:32]<Veltas> You can't teach security
[23:32]<Veltas> No I am kidding obviously security courses are fair enough
[23:33]<Veltas> You can't teach art
[23:34]<jamer> Hell I have a digital forensics class also.. Would never go with the degree in it from the college I'm at
[23:34]<Veltas> "Would never go with the degree in it from the college I'm at"
[23:34]<Veltas> What?
[23:34]<+camerongray> That's what I love about our system, I study general "Computer Science" and can basically pick any courses that interest me
[23:35]<Veltas> I study "Maths" and can basically pick terrible courses because I took the wrong subject
[23:35]<+camerongray> hahaha
[23:35]<jamer> The digital forensics degree is only a 2 year degree
[23:35]<+camerongray> And they are all interesting things you can't easily teach yourself
[23:35]<+camerongray> For example there is nothing of "this is a motherboard, this is a processor, the processor goes on the motherboard"
[23:35]<Veltas> No that can't be right
[23:36]<+camerongray> It's all "This is how you would design and build a processor from scratch, go and do it as a coursework"
[23:36]<Veltas> That sounds much more practical than most CS degrees
[23:36]<+camerongray> There's quite a bit of coursework but it really depends on the course
[23:36]<Veltas> "This is how you would design and design a design from scratch, go and design a design.
[23:36]<Veltas> "
[23:37]<+camerongray> For example in computer architecture the coursework was to implement a program to simulate various caches and policies
[23:37]<+camerongray> Then for operating systems it was all about modifying the linux scheduler
[23:37]<Veltas> At Warwick there are lots of algorithms classes, classes on lots of computer design, the coursework is mainly programming stuff, although there was an essay
[23:37]<+camerongray> Then neteworking was to basically implement TCP over sockets
[23:37]<Veltas> Yeah I don't think they had any OS coursework
[23:38]<+camerongray> It's practical to the extent that it teaches understanding but isn't too easy or boring
[23:38]<Veltas> camerongray that sounds like a very pratical approach to CS
[23:38]<+camerongray> Yeah, it's pretty good
[23:38]<Veltas> Warwick is a lot more theoretical than that
[23:38]<Veltas> I think...
[23:38]<+camerongray> Although most courses are still 75% exam weighted
[23:38]<Veltas> I mean I don't do CS at Warwick
[23:39]<Veltas> My courses are all 85% or 100% exam weighted
[23:39]<@BC_Programming> you college people and your degrees
[23:39]<Veltas> I calculated (my course starts tomorrow/today) I have a 60 hour week
[23:39]<+camerongray> One of the courses this year is going to be awesome, we are basically given a bunch of ARM mBed devices and £100 budget to make a thing as a group
[23:39]<@BC_Programming> and your sex parties
[23:39]<@BC_Programming> and your eight-track tapes
[23:39]<+camerongray> So many sex parties ;P
[23:40]<Veltas> It's not fair, you shouldn't be able to enjoy yourself for 3 years and get a degree at the end of it
[23:40]<Veltas> That sounds wrong
[23:40]<+camerongray> lol, 3 years, silly English people :P
[23:40]<+camerongray> Ours are 4 year
[23:40]<Veltas> Or 4 years
[23:40]<Veltas> Oh yes and your courses are free
[23:41]<+camerongray> haha, yep!
[23:41]<Veltas> Hmmm I don't really want to talk about it then, IMO Scotland should have left. They didn't because we all know why.
[23:41]<+camerongray> Not getting into tha t;P
[23:41]<@BC_Programming> Scotland is the Quebec of the UK, but not full of wankers
[23:42]<Veltas> I don't like the divide because I live in a very poor area that could really do with the kind of special treatment Scotland gets
[23:42]<Veltas> But they don't get it because they are in England so obviously they don't deserve attention
[23:42]<@BC_Programming> I like how you said you won't get into it and then you do
[23:43]<Veltas> No I said I don't want to talk about it
[23:43]<+camerongray> Also, this was one of our courses last year: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRECLl4SMVI
[23:43]<Veltas> And I'm done saying my piece
[23:43]<+camerongray> Make a robot to play football against other robots
[23:43]<+camerongray> My group's is the one second closest to the camera with the yellow bit on the top
[23:45]<@BC_Programming> That was interference, a player was lifted off by a giant
[23:46]<+camerongray> haha
[23:46]<+camerongray> It went out of its zone
[23:48]<@BC_Programming> I only have a High School Diploma myself :P
[23:48]<Veltas> Different generation
[23:49]<@BC_Programming> I'm 28, how different?
[23:49]<Veltas> <insert some lie about how I'm happy that I went to uni>
[23:49]<Veltas> Oh okay I assumed you were like 40 from how you talk to people
[23:50]<Veltas> I'm 22
[23:50]<+camerongray> I don't know if I would have rushed to uni as much as I did if I'd had to pay
[23:50]<@BC_Programming> "how you talk to people" and how is that whippersnapper?
[23:50]<@BC_Programming> Back in my day we used to wear onions on our belt, it being the fashion of the time
[23:50]<Veltas> You throw people under the bus a lot
[23:51]<Veltas> That is a Simpsons quote
[23:51]<+camerongray> Jeez, I've been here over 6 years now
[23:51]<@BC_Programming> grats
[23:51]<@BC_Programming> I think
[23:52]<@BC_Programming> It's interesting that some CH people still check in on us
[23:52]<@BC_Programming> good to know they still care huh
[23:52]<Veltas> I hope you're not referring to me
[23:52]<@BC_Programming> no
[23:52]<@BC_Programming> loonytoon and db pop in a few seconds sometimes
[23:53]<@BC_Programming> just scrolled back and saw it
[23:53]<Veltas> db drives me practically insane with his use and spacing of punctuation
[23:53]<@BC_Programming> it does make his alts obvious though so that's a positive
[23:54]<Veltas> well . i suppose its all , a matter of opinion ...
[23:55]<+camerongray> lol
[23:55]<+camerongray> I don't get why they are obsessed with us
[23:55]<+camerongray> Like, does anyone here now actually ever say anything in CH?
[23:56]<Veltas> patio does this thing where he misinterprets something I've said on #CH and then takes every opportunity to try and make me look like an imbecile in front of people being helped
[23:56]<+camerongray> Yeah, so glad I gave up on it
[23:56]<+camerongray> It's crazy, I actually feel better in daily life without it
[23:57]<@BC_Programming> "Home premium hasn't had Aero on any system I've seen" classic
[23:57]<Veltas> And I said one thing in retort and a mod called me out and warned be I'd get kicked if I questioned anything patio said again
[23:57]<@BC_Programming> haha wtf
[23:57]<+camerongray> I still participate in the forums but even that is dying
[23:57]<Veltas> My saving grace is I think Quant realises I'm not a massive troll and have actually helped people
[23:58]<jamer> I'm just in #ch just to see the drama and have a laugh
[23:58]<+camerongray> Yeah, basically there for logging
[23:59]<+camerongray> It's hidden in my client
[23:59]<Veltas> Oh yes #CH has infinite value in reading it. I have found myself often laughing aloud at conversations on there, and just thinking about the situation and its novelty